Author Topic: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II  (Read 2681 times)

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« on: May 21, 2010, 02:33:37 PM »
For $10!  Haha. 

So what do I need to know before installing this thing and firing up my Jedi?  I played, and loved, KotOR.  Played it through as a pure light-side, a pure dark-side, and in the middle.  I'm guessing I can do the same in the sequel?

Any tips on building a light-side Jedi?

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Pixelated

  • Discombobulated Pixie
  • Jah
  • Posts: 20249
  • Looking for a recombobulation area
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2010, 04:20:20 PM »
Sorry, can't help. Never got out of the first area before the game bored me. :lol: (and I was supremely disappointed by that fact, considering that I adored KOTOR1)


Aim low. Less chance of disappointment. More chance of a nutshot.

If you don't have idiot friends, it's possible you are the idiot friend.

Thrugg

  • Inscrutable
  • Lem
  • Posts: 4814
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2010, 05:05:06 AM »
Pay no attention to Mr Grumpypants.  This game has its own different nuances, and maybe isn't quite as slick as K1, but it's well worth the $10.

Character creation is largely the same.  You will be fine to go as whichever alignment you like.  I would say they put a little more emphasis on skills in the sequel so Sentinels really shine (imo of course).  But you would still be fine with the other base classes.  You can switch out your team mates in most places anyway and master hacker T3-M4 is still around.

The first two zones are indeed kind of long, more so than in K1.  I really like the first zone actually, have done it 7 or 8 times.  But I am notorious for preferring new toons over high level ones :)  After you get through those though the game pretty much opens out into the familiar "4 planets, any order" from K1.

Really the biggest difference everyone notices is the new Influence.  The intention was to expand on your relationships with the NPCs on your team, so you can get + and - with them by your actions compared to what they want to do.  In a lot of cases it's fairly obvious, HK-47 likes you murdering, T3-M4 likes you to save the universe.  They don't know what they don't see, so you can even game the system a bit by switching people out right before you do something you know they won't like.  But, there are also frustrations with the system.  Sometimes early on you are forced to group with two people with opposite alignments so no matter what you do you piss off one.  Important thing to remember is that you get plenty of opportunities to fix it - most Influence points are actually gained by long conversations with people back on the ship where you learn their stories - and in the end the game would be completable even if everybody hates you.  There are rewards for making each NPC love you, like +1 Int or Computer skill or something from T3, but if you don't care about power gaming that's no biggie, and if you do care, well, Google up "Kotor 2 Influence Guide" and some ubernerd who took the time to chart every single dialog option will tell you exactly how to max out Influence with everybody :lol:

Save often.  There is more bugs to be sure.  And sometimes you miss an obvious Influence check that you may want to redo just because it is obvious.  You actually can't go too wrong going light side, it's Dark side where the Influence stuff can be annoying.

I think Lego started a character build thread somewhere in this forum, but if not I can pull up some of my builds.  There isn't really a ton of difference, aside from instead of starting as a commoner and learning to be a Jedi, you start as a Jedi and learn to be a Superjedi.  Which is pretty cool.
"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."? - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2010, 01:26:15 PM »
Thanks for the tips.  But considering I played KotOR I at least three years ago I've forgotten about everything.  For my first character I'd like a light-side force user that relies on lightsabers to deal out damage.  I'm thinking either a Guardian/Weapon-master (or marauder) or a Sentinel/Weapon-master.

And if I wanted to go for the same but using force powers more It's be a Consular/Jedi Master (or Sith Lord), right?

That about right?

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Thrugg

  • Inscrutable
  • Lem
  • Posts: 4814
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2010, 02:38:24 PM »
I like to be heavy on skills in K2.  It does cost you a little bit in total power of your character but it just makes the game more fun to play.  Plus you get a lot of exp for doing skill things in game (like unlocking and disarming) so I think you make up for the cost by being higher level sooner.

As a result I usually take Sentinel as my base for a fighting char.  Almost as many feats but way more skills, as well as more class skills (the ones that re cheap to raise) so the extra points go even further.  But if you want to max out your total damage and hit points you would go with a Guardian and just smash all the doors open.

The next decision is typically to be a Str-based or Dex-based fighter.  Str raises weapon damage and also gives you +hit.  Dex raises your armor class but can also be used for +hit if you take the Weapon Finesse feats.  You don't get to use a lightsaber for a while so you end up having to use 2 feats to go Dex-based, one for finesse with regular weaps and one for finesse with sabers.  Fighter types have a lot of feats to go around though so it is a personal choice.  Str hits harder, Dex is more defensive.  I tend to go Str based just because it's simpler, and needs less points spent (which I need for my skills).  A non-skilled pure fighter actually has more points spare to go Dex-based, which is maybe counter-intuitive but that's what you get from a point-spend character system :)

Your CON is your hit points as usual and your INT is your skills.  WIS and CHA are about force powers so they can be left low for a fighter type.  So you end up with these kinds of templates that I use to start my characters:  (STR - DEX - CON - INT - WIS - CHA)

skilled Sentinel: 15-10-14-16-10-10  (I hate to leave anything at 8 even if I won't use it much)
strong Guardian: 16-12-16-10-10-10
finesse Guardian: 15-16-14-10-10-10

There are tons of items that raise stats of course plus you get to add a raw point every 4 levels.

For the skills, you want to take at least 1 point in pretty much everything, just to open up certain options you won't get with 0.  Stealth I skip because the only time its needed you have flunkies to do it for you.  With the 16 Int Sentinel you can pretty much paint the whole sheet with max class skills and 1 in the others, but with the Guardian you have to be more frugal - keep Persuade and Treat Injury up and just try to get a single point into the others.

For feats, you'll certainly want Two Weapon Fighting (whether for dual or double saber) and then your choice of Critical Strike or Flurry for combat.  By the end you can probably max out both but you generally want to go as deep as you can into one before going wide.  You will also probably want Toughness at some point (more HP), Finesse if you are going Dex, and things like Weapon Focus and Specialisation if you can (just for lightsabers though). 
If you go the skilled Sentinel, a nice trick is to also pick up the Class Skill feats, which let you raise the other skills you don't start with for cheap.  If you want to get those, get them early, no point putting points into things at double cost if you can do it at single.  With those picked up you can max out all skills except Stealth and really see the whole game.  But, it does use up feats and Sentinels don't get as many as Guardians.  So when I do that I basically have to pick just one fighting style and stick with it.

That about covers character creation.  Game play tips available on request :)
"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."? - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2010, 07:03:13 AM »
Played for three hours last night getting my character through hopefully most of the first area.  Tried to start it up this morning and it won't start.  The effing game won't start.  ARGH!

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Thrugg

  • Inscrutable
  • Lem
  • Posts: 4814
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2010, 12:46:28 PM »
There are quite a few reasons that may happen :(  Would need to know more about your machine to guess which is yours.  I would start with this one though:

* First, figure out where the .ini is installed. Default is "C:\Program Files\Lucasarts\swkotor(2)\swkotor(2).ini". If its not in that location, then your going to have to do some searching around on the hard drive a bit.
* When you find it, just double-click on the file to open it in Notepad.
* Scroll down the file until you find the Graphics Options
* Under the last line ("last line" as in the last line of the list of entries under "Graphics Options", NOT the last line of "swkotor(2).ini), add "Disable Vertex Buffer Objects=1", without the quotes.
* Goto File, then Save.

Also, if you are on an OS more recent than XP (ie Vista or 7) you should probably run in XP compatibility mode.  That said I have not played it since I was using XP so I'm not sure how much that helps.
"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."? - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2010, 02:06:06 PM »
Well damndest thing.  I came back to the computer later and shut down Firefox and KotOR2 fired right up.  Thanks though.  Hopefully it won't happen again. 

Got on board my ship and we're on the way to Telos. 

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2010, 10:35:38 AM »
Here's the deal.  I want to play through this first time without scoring ANY darkside points.  Then I'd like to play though again wihtout scoring ANY lightside points.  I would like to avoid spoilers if possible but I'd rather some minor spoilers than get mixed up in something dark this time.  So does anyone know a guide that just lists the various side (or main) quests and tells you what they earn you in terms of Light/Dark?

For example, I'm on Telos now and just got asked by some hot thug chick to help kill her boss.  Now, it sure feels dark to me, but killing a major crime boss might not be all evil, right?  And maybe it's necessary to progress the main plot. 

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Thrugg

  • Inscrutable
  • Lem
  • Posts: 4814
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2010, 11:17:08 AM »
Killing your dark master to then take his place is classic dark side behaviour :)  The force is all about means not ends and is not impressed by pragmatism...
But Kotor 2 is a lot about showing that the world is full of shades of grey and you have to work hard to find a purely Light solution to every scenario.  You may be setting yourself a difficult goal first time through, there are some serious catch-22s ahead of you.

To answer your first Q, I haven't seen one.  Some of the quest chain trees get fairly involved, with many interdependencies on what you have already done.  It would be hard for a guide to simply say "Quest X = 1 LS point".

In this case though, assuming you're talking about Luxa and Slusk, you won't be able to progress the main story without agreeing with her, but you will get an opportunity to retain your Lightside integrity before the whole episode plays out.

"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."? - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2010, 12:18:10 PM »
Okay.  I'll just try and be more Zen about it and do my best.  Don't like just muddling through things.  I was hooping for a "Quest X = 1 LS point" list but oh well. 

As a general rule of thumb, are the following statements true?

- A Sentinel Weaponmaster/Marauder who intends to do most of his killing with a lightsaber is better off with armor (heavy?) while a Consular Jedi Master/Sith Lord who intends to do most of his killing with force powers is generally better off with robes.

- A Sentinel Weaponmaster/Marauder that intends to do most of his killing with a lightsaber is better off pumping either strength OR dexterity while a Consular Master/Sith Lord who intends to do most of his killing with force powers is generally better off pumping Wisdom AND Intelligence.

- If one were interested in power gaming this thing, one would be better off keeping generally lightside/neutral party members around for influence if their main character was exclusive light, while a darkside exclusive character would be better off keeping generally darkside/neutral party members around.

Thanks.

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Thrugg

  • Inscrutable
  • Lem
  • Posts: 4814
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2010, 04:55:52 PM »
There are some pretty nice special robes that are halfway between robes and armor, ie they have armor and can be fitted with armor upgrades but they don't prevent force powers.  Wearing armor will cut out a lot of your powers, and even if you mostly swirl your saber, it's nice to have buffs like Speed.  But you certainly can use real armor, esp if you are all Str and no Dex.  If you go with Dex, you might as well use a lighter type of armor/robe that lets you benefit from your big Dex bonus.

Yes on the Str or Dex for fighters.  Casters need Wis and Charisma.  Charisma makes your spells harder to resist (even your lightning bolts).  Wis is probably still more important but you can't leave Cha behind.  Int is only used for skills.

The easiest path is to use clearly light siders when you go light and vice versa.  Some people are neither one nor the other inherently though, and are happy to go whichever way you do.  They ventured outside the confines of one-dimensional alignment where you're just good or bad, to include people who eg don't mind if you are lawful and good or lawful and evil, so long as you are lawful.  So you have quite a lot of party options.
"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."? - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2010, 05:39:35 PM »
Thanks.  This first character is planning on lightsabers only as much as possible and he'll probably keep Kruela or whatever the old one-handed woman's name is around for buffs.  But here's a question.  When the game is turn-based, what good does the speed buff do?

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther

Thrugg

  • Inscrutable
  • Lem
  • Posts: 4814
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #13 on: May 24, 2010, 09:39:33 PM »
As well as doubling your movement speed and increasing your chace to hit with special attacks, the higher ranks add extra attacks per round.  Master Speed is 2 extra attacks per round and +4 to your roll on any special attacks for 30 seconds or so.  It's pretty sexeh.

Other buffs you can't use with armor on are Master Valor (+5 to all stats for the whole party), Force Resist/Immunity (increase chance to resist enemy force powers) and Force Armor (+6 to resists and armor).  You don't use all of those every fight even if you have them, but loading them all up before a key fight can make it a lot easier.  Also (minor spoiler) later on you can receive a special power that casts all those at once, after which you pretty much do use them all each fight, but that also only works without real armor on.

That said there are some very nice armors available by the time you get those kinds of powers, that offer great buffs of their own.  I think either way is perfectly viable.
"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."? - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

Butch

  • Minister of Divine Fermentation
  • Mal
  • Posts: 7510
  • Supplanter of the ole-time god of wisdom - 2012
    • Raise Your Pints
Re: Just got Knights of the Old Republic II
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2010, 05:34:37 AM »
Other buffs you can't use with armor on are Master Valor (+5 to all stats for the whole party), Force Resist/Immunity (increase chance to resist enemy force powers) and Force Armor (+6 to resists and armor). 

Do I still get the benefits of these if a party member casts them while my main character is wearing armor?

Butch
"Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God."
  - Martin Luther