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The Scrying Chamber => Bioware Games => Topic started by: Ambar on November 18, 2004, 05:01:43 PM

Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 18, 2004, 05:01:43 PM
Be quick, starting in 10 minutes :D
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 18, 2004, 05:14:09 PM
OK.

Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 10
Int: 12
Wis: 14
Cha:12
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 18, 2004, 05:18:13 PM
Quote from: "Legolas"
OK.

Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 10
Int: 12
Wis: 14
Cha:12


Thanks, but that leaves 2 left over....recommend puts them in Cha.  Is that good enough?  Flurry for the one feat I get?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 18, 2004, 05:20:33 PM
Quote from: "Ambar"
Quote from: "Legolas"
OK.

Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 10
Int: 12
Wis: 14
Cha:12


Thanks, but that leaves 2 left over....recommend puts them in Cha.  Is that good enough?  Flurry for the one feat I get?


OOps. Yepper, Charisma. I would probably take Dueling for the first feat, and go with Crit. Strike after that. But, if I were going Flurry, I would still wait a bit on it as a scoundrel. You won't hit squat with it until you get a little higher BAB, so I'd still take dueling first ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 18, 2004, 05:21:19 PM
Thanks!
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 18, 2004, 05:22:14 PM
Oh, and since he/she's going Guardian, I would put all my subsequent points into Dex ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 18, 2004, 05:26:09 PM
INT 12 is two completely wasted points. Either go 10 or 14 (for one extra skill point per level).

;)

CON > 10 for a scoundrel, or that 6 VP/level is gonna suxxor.

Ah well, you already started. Sucks to be you. That's what you get for listening to Legoass. :P :P :P
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 18, 2004, 05:30:29 PM
think how rough he'd be if my life DIDN'T suck right now  :evil:

nah, on the Con, you can make that up easily enough with toughness. Especially as a guardian, you'll be wanting the extra Force points more than the extra HP, especially as your Scoundrel sneak attacks will rely on stun-type force powers after the initial Force Jump ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 18, 2004, 06:18:01 PM
Ok, this is like brand new to me again *sigh*

Took Dueling at level one and implants at level 2 for feats.

Skills are as follows:

Computer use 2
Demolition  0
Stealth  5
Aware  4
Persuade 0
Repair  2
Security  5
Treat Injury  0

Two (2) points saved.

Trying now to use the freaking workbench.  I have a prototype vibro sword (upgradable) and some vibro thing-a-majig but I can't seem to put them together.  Oh well.

Time to go exploring.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 18, 2004, 06:23:23 PM
Ok. No more points into repair or computers. Since you won't be getting enough to,err, do something later, there's plenty of party folks who can do it better ;-)

You might want to put at least 1 point into Demolition, as it's pretty easy to accidently use a stimpak every time you run into a mine if you don't (at least on the Xbox control scheme)

If you're going to try to take the implant tree, be careful to get only implant, dueling, and crit. feats - you won't have much to spare ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 19, 2004, 06:25:02 AM
Do you guys autolevel the "henchmen" or do you go through each one carefully?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 19, 2004, 06:33:57 AM
Autolevel = Teh SuXXoR :P

The computer is clueless and will gimp your NPCs badly. Really.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 19, 2004, 06:38:02 AM
That's what I thought.  Thanks.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 19, 2004, 08:11:27 AM
Quote from: "Luchaire"
Autolevel = Teh SuXXoR :P

The computer is clueless and will gimp your NPCs badly. Really.


Truly. I've goofed off a little with it. It gave my Scout Crit Strike, Sniper Shot, Power Attack etc... all these feats at the worthless 1st level. Then it proceeded to give my Gearhead  :roll: Making your own choices, however informed or uninformed, HAS to be better than the autolevel ;-)

That said, though, I think the game's funner with some variety. It seems all the little munchkins like to give everyone but Jolee and Mission Dual-Weild, Flurry, and have them run around with 2 Vibros. I like to keep Carth's 2 blasters, Canderous' Heavy Gun (although they're rather worthless), etc...
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 20, 2004, 09:10:15 AM
Time to restart.  I've hit a dead end at the Sith Base.  Mostly dead and no medipacks to heal or credits to buy more.  Damn Droid is expensive!  Perhaps I should have taken Bastila with me (the WENCH).  I really don't like her attitude.

The scoundrel's sneak attacks are worthless as far as I can tell.  You can only go in stealth mode when solo and I never seem to get a sneak attack in.

I did hit the 30 second mark in the swoop race on my second attempt.  Not too bad, methinks.

Probably going to try a Scout.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 20, 2004, 09:48:12 AM
Yeah, I don't think I've ever really even tried the sith base without bastila  :shock:  I can only imagine how much that would suck if you weren't a soldier yourself.

With Mission, yeah, at lower levels she's not anywhere near as useful as at higher levels. She'll get alot more sneaks in if you let her use a blaster instead of a sword. Solo mode doesn't work in combat after the initial hit, and honestly, I never put more than 1 point into it because I never use it. But anyways, later in the game, she'll be a joy, with her higher BAB and 9 or 10 d6 sneaks, with a nice high-level blaster. So just give her the blaster and let her do her thing. The sneaks will come ;-)

Something that works for me on the Taris swoop race - do the entire first race in 2nd gear. You'll finish in 36 someodd seconds, and the mark to beat will only be something in the low 36ish. Then, balls out on the second race, and you'll never have a problem beating it.

If you're having a problem with combat, why not try a soldier to start? Yeah, a well-built Scout/Sentinel is the deadliest combo in the game, but an armored Soldier/Guardian is an unstoppable tank.

With an armored soldier, leave Dex at 10 or 11. Bring Int. to 8, put Con at 14, and Str. at 16. Everything else into Wis and Cha (they both add modifiers to your Force Point totals). Pump Str at every turn. Dual-weild. You'll cut thru baddies like a hot knife thru butter, all the way from start to finish ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 20, 2004, 10:37:02 AM
Quote from: "Ambar"
Time to restart.  I've hit a dead end at the Sith Base.  Mostly dead and no medipacks to heal or credits to buy more.
Damn Droid is expensive!  Perhaps I should have taken Bastila with me (the WENCH).  I really don't like her attitude.



Bastila + Cure. Never use another medpack again. ;)

As for the droid... for a few dark side points, you can get it for free...

Quote
The scoundrel's sneak attacks are worthless as far as I can tell.  You can only go in stealth mode when solo and I never seem to get a sneak attack in.


Solo is worthless. But sneak attacks are quite useful - IF you use it properly. (1) With force jump as a guardian; (2) attacking from behind while your other party members have the baddies distracted; and most especially - (3) when the bad guy is stunned from your timely use of critical strike or concussion grenades, etc.

Quote
I did hit the 30 second mark in the swoop race on my second attempt.  Not too bad, methinks.

Probably going to try a Scout.


Scouts are great fun. Best class skills, best feats... But for a guardian, I'd still stick with a scoundrel. Or a soldier for a pure tank character.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 20, 2004, 10:24:08 PM
No real choice here.  No saves left pre-military base.

Not sure what I want to do here.  Started a scout, but made him a male.  His backside doesn't do much for me like the females do  :D
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 21, 2004, 09:27:36 AM
I decided to start my own scoundrel/guardian last night, as playing the dark side character just isn't all that fun really.

Started her with these stats:

STR 10
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 14
CHA 12

Will put 4 points in Dex and 1 into Wis at level ups. Going dual sabers with crit strike, and will use force powers for master speed, destroy droid, and stunning effects to maximize sneak attacks. Also going to pump demolitions and stealth with this one - I want to try the "Sneak in and lay mines" tactic...

Of course, I'm also still toying with making her a scoundrel/sentinel instead, for the sentinel's immunities and a few extra force points. I'll have to work out whether I'd get enough feats that way.

Zaalbar will be my main meat shield and enemy distracter, plus he'll have the two skills I don't - computer use and repair. Jolee will probably come along for his lovely array of force powers.

Should be fun. ;)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 21, 2004, 01:47:41 PM
It should indeed ;-)

Last night I started on a Soldier/Consular, a combo I've never even tried. I put Str at 10, Int at 8, and put Wis and Cha at 14 each. Going to go robed, taking Dueling, Flurry, and Implants.

I have no idea how viable this is, but it should be a good combo of tank/caster. We'll see. Oughtta be a helluva ride, anyway.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 21, 2004, 08:21:40 PM
Heh, I got bored at work tonight so I wrote up complete level-by-level builds for a few different chars I'll try sometime, including a scoundrel/consular (LS), soldier/guardian (DS), and armored scout/guardian (LS). Soldier/consular was next on my to-do list, but I ran out of time. ;)

I'll probably start one or more of these 3 tonight... :D
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 21, 2004, 08:27:24 PM
Besides Scout/Sentinel, I've done Scoundrel/Guardian (DS), and most recently Scoundrel/Consular (got my ass KICKED the first two times I tried one, but for some reason, this last one was STUPID powerful  :shock: )

Getting ready to go into the Taris underworld with the Soldier that will go Consular. So far, just using a rifle to get a bit of +tohit, with my 10 Str.

Of course, I have no idea how he'll do yet, not until I start taking the Consular levels  :?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 23, 2004, 05:50:12 PM
Ok, on one hand, persuade is an important skill to have.  On the other hand, it is a cross-class skill for a scout.  So, do I pump it every other level, or do I blow it off?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 23, 2004, 07:01:28 PM
Quote from: "Ambar"
Ok, on one hand, persuade is an important skill to have.  On the other hand, it is a cross-class skill for a scout.  So, do I pump it every other level, or do I blow it off?


Neither. Do what I do, and save 4 points at startup, and 1 each subsequent level. When you take your Jedi class, it's a class skill for all 3. At that point, dump your saved points in at 1:1 ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 23, 2004, 07:09:03 PM
Thanks Lego.  What should I be pumping then?  Awareness seems important, as does computer use, repair etc...

I get so confused, probably because I don't have a good plan for what I want to do.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 23, 2004, 07:43:06 PM
Going off memory here, but my scout/sentinel ended up with 18 points each in computer use and repair (for a total mod of +20 with intel bonus). Awareness was brought to 8, demolitions to 8 (with +2, that was enough to recover any minor mine or disable any average/deadly one). Treat injury also to 8, the rest went in persuade after taking jedi levels. Oh, and 1 point in security - that's enough to open those pesky "low security doors" in Taris and save the tedium of either bashing them or switching to Carth/Mission. ;)

Of course, she had a 14 intel, so she had lots of skill points (84 total, iirc). With a 10-12 intel, you'd have 23 less points to play with...

Repair absolutely positively MUST reach at least 17, for reasons I won't divulge, but trust me (and Lego) on this one. ;)

Edit, I have a scout/guardian build here all written up on paper if you're interested. Level by level skills, feats, and powers... Also a scoundrel/consular and soldier/guardian (currently being played and totally pwning everything - 10-40 damage per hit times 5 attacks/round at level 14 :shock: )
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 23, 2004, 09:52:19 PM
Bloody good idea on character builds. In fact, I think we'll make it a sticky ;-)

Oh, and yes, a Scout/anything MUST put 17 points into repair. I unequivically promise it will pay off ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on November 24, 2004, 06:05:20 AM
Actually, you don't need to have 17 natural points. Use and abuse items with +Computer use, and don't forget Master Valor which will boost a stat giving another +1 to the skill.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 24, 2004, 06:12:04 AM
Quote from: "Mad Godji"
Actually, you don't need to have 17 natural points. Use and abuse items with +Computer use, and don't forget Master Valor which will boost a stat giving another +1 to the skill.


Hmm... according to various posts and reports on the Bioware boards, only your base skill plus your intelligence modifier is taken into account for this particular use of the skill - force powers and equipment bonuses are not.

Have not tested this myself, of course, since my scouts max repair anyway.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on November 24, 2004, 06:38:22 AM
Well, I hadn't gone far enough with my Scout/Consular to check the last repair (which requires 17), but I had reached all the ones before WITH buffs (the one before requires 13 IIRC).
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 24, 2004, 08:43:46 AM
Hmm... thats' strange. Every report and post I've ever read, even from the devs, state a natural 17 is needed, pre-buff, and pre-stat mod.

Either your install is bugged, or they're all wrong  :?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 24, 2004, 03:34:57 PM
So I came across this really fascinating thread today over at Bioware...

http://swforums.bioware.com/viewtopic.html?topic=396285&forum=76

;)


Two-timing us, huh? What, our advice not good enough?

*sniffle*
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 24, 2004, 03:36:22 PM
Quote from: "Luchaire"
So I came across this really fascinating thread today over at Bioware...

http://swforums.bioware.com/viewtopic.html?topic=396285&forum=76

;)


Two-timing us, huh? What, our advice not good enough?

*sniffle*


Can you blame me?  I waited at least 15 minutes for a reply here  :D
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 24, 2004, 03:39:03 PM
I guess no one told you the 33 minute rule huh?

*sigh*

Lego, would you explain it to him?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 24, 2004, 03:57:28 PM
Better yet, I'll show him the picture of the last person to break the 33 minute rule:

(http://www.brotherhoodofthelamb.com/AmericanSkinPhotoLink/Beatdown.JPG)

The Bioware forum really had fun that day, although it took hours to clean all the blood from everything...
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 24, 2004, 04:07:10 PM
Fine, then.  I won't bother you guys anymore
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on November 24, 2004, 06:37:53 PM
Quote from: "Ambar"
Fine, then.  I won't bother you guys anymor


Noooo! You can't stop bothering us! You're like, err... one-third of the active Bioware forum! :) :P





Erm... you weren't taking this whole thing seriously, were you?  :?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 24, 2004, 08:53:35 PM
Dammit, Luch - how many times have I told you to quit messing with Bioware Forumites when they're on thier period?

This is what we get. Good going man.

Oooooooo Kaaaaaaaaaay Ambar. We were kidding. No need to be pissy. It was a joke.

And I've kicked Luch's ass for you ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 25, 2004, 08:29:05 PM
bite my freaking ass   :D

ps:  read your PM's  :D
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 25, 2004, 11:59:04 PM
Quote from: "Ambar"
bite my freaking ass   :D


That's the spirit!  :D

Love ya man ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on November 26, 2004, 12:18:54 AM
Quote from: "Ambar"
bite my freaking ass


This, along with Lego's comments on passionate assholes, makes me afraid of the Bioware forum.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Ambar on November 26, 2004, 01:25:49 AM
Quote from: "SirWarkof"
Quote from: "Ambar"
bite my freaking ass


This, along with Lego's comments on passionate assholes, makes me afraid of the Bioware forum.


[yoda]

Not afraid, are you?  You will be.....you will be.

Nine hundred years old you get, look as good you'll not!

[/yoda]
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 26, 2004, 08:36:50 AM
:lmao:

You know... I wouldn't trade you guys for the finest people on earth  :lol:
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on November 26, 2004, 08:47:42 AM
Of course, we're ALREADY the finest people on Earth!
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on November 26, 2004, 09:01:03 AM
Quote from: "Mad Godji"
Of course, we're ALREADY the finest people on Earth!


We are?

Not good. Someone page Ozymandias, ask him if he'd like a hand.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 26, 2004, 09:04:25 AM
Ok. I just got off the phone with him. He says he has 2 already, and wouldn't know where to graft a third.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on November 26, 2004, 09:24:34 AM
Then ask him what happens if they shoot three bullets at him.

Also, we need to organize a hostile takeover of GO by the Bioware sub-forum.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 26, 2004, 12:46:47 PM
Quote from: "SirWarkof"
Then ask him what happens if they shoot three bullets at him.

Also, we need to organize a hostile takeover of GO by the Bioware sub-forum.


He says you have a point.

Now, who'shand do we send him?[/i]
Title: -Quells the rebellion-
Post by: nanenj on November 26, 2004, 07:49:45 PM
No hostile takeovers allowed.

Cute Fairy Rule #223 Subsection A Paragraph 4 clearly states.:  NO HOSTILE TAKEOVERS!

So, nyah.

Also, in 2 hours, I'll have knights of the old republic :D fun fun :D
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Jedi44 on November 27, 2004, 12:06:18 AM
Rachel, we're Jedi.

We do what we want.

Once we conquer the rest of the forums, can I have the Bar all to myself?
Title: No. :P
Post by: nanenj on November 27, 2004, 03:43:31 AM
See above, that's No.  It's the opposite of Yes.
Title: Re: -Quells the rebellion-
Post by: SirWarkof on November 27, 2004, 04:48:52 AM
Quote from: "Snowfairy"
Cute Fairy Rule #223 Subsection A Paragraph 4 clearly states.:  NO HOSTILE TAKEOVERS!


I AM THE LAW!

And I declare we can take over.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 27, 2004, 12:13:56 PM
Rise, Lord Wafkof.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on November 27, 2004, 12:34:28 PM
Quote from: "Legolas"
Rise, Lord Wafkof.


Man, fuck the dark side. Obviously, the most nefarious power in the universe is the Typo.

This theory made sense, until it occurred to me that MicTar must be the leader of the most powerful power there is. There's a spoke in the wheel, right there.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on November 27, 2004, 12:48:30 PM
Dammit, you have exposed me as Darth Typonus.

You will have to be promptly dealt with.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 06, 2004, 10:57:59 AM
If we may briefly steer this thread vaguely back towards computer gaming...

So you may well be entertained to know that on Sunday morning my usually hardline stance on games that aren't called Diablo buckled and I installed KOTOR.  Some trepidation with this, as my computer is less than cutting edge.  However the installer was very helpful and told me the only problem was my old video drivers, and upgraded them for me :)  I still get a yellow warning light (I have a GeForce 440 MX as it seems is common around here) but may I say, game ran flawlessly, with all video options on, for 12 hours straight, from when it finished installing until I realised it was 1:20 this morning  :roll:  :lol:

OMG this is teh fun.  And I know I am barely a smidge into the game (just resuced the accelerator, haven't done the swoop race yet).  A paltry return for an entire day's play, I imagine, but I like to take my time with a new game (I think I talked to every single NPC on Taris...)

So, some noob questions, of course.  As is my style, I started my first char as a Soldier planning to be Guardian (Light).  Me Thrugg, me smash stuff good.  I have read a bit around, and am fairly confident that I know what I am doing with my main char.  But I am not nearly so sure about the party members.

Do they get to become Jedi too?  Do I want them to?  Do things befall them (ie I don't want to rely on one of my helpers being the only one who can use the computer if he/she is going to sod off halfway through the game)?  Any general advice on team management greatly appreciated.

I'm currently sitting with my party all having about enough exp to go up to level 6 but still sitting on 4 - I want my main char to go 4/16 but if the others aren't ever going to Jedi up I could use the extra HP and skills :P
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Sssith on December 06, 2004, 11:21:40 AM
Q: Are NWN characters allowed to participate in the take over of the forums or is only for you prissy Jedi types?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Jedi44 on December 06, 2004, 11:51:30 AM
Pretty sure only masters of the Force will be able to conquer the other forums. Maybe you NWN types could make sure a nice warm meal is waiting for the conquerors when we get back?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on December 06, 2004, 01:24:05 PM
Quote from: "Thrugg"
Do they get to become Jedi too?


No.

Quote
Do things befall them (ie I don't want to rely on one of my helpers being the only one who can use the computer if he/she is going to sod off halfway through the game)?


Yep. But to answer this without spoilers would be impossible. Suffice to say, though, relying on them is pretty much a given - as there is no way to build a character who can do everything. As a light-side character, you won't need to worry about the "befalling" as much though. ;)

Quote
I'm currently sitting with my party all having about enough exp to go up to level 6 but still sitting on 4 - I want my main char to go 4/16 but if the others aren't ever going to Jedi up I could use the extra HP and skills :P


If you're holding levels, the ideal mix has been statistically proven (over and over ad nauseum) to be 5/15 - regardless of class. Personally I don't recommend this. The game is easy enough to beat without this powergaming/twinkie tactic, and just "playing it through" without min/maxing everything is far more fun and rewarding in the end.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 06, 2004, 01:51:58 PM
Cheers Luch.

One other thing that I totally forgot in my post - upgrading items.  I am an "examine every corner and take everything that isn't tied down" type of player so I have already got a few upgradeable items and upgrades for them.  I figured that I might as well use upgrades on items I am currently wearing as soon as I find them.  But is one (items or upgrades) more plentiful than the other?  ie Should I save either for better versions later in the game (kinda like I never socket jewels in D2 because I always think I'll find a better base item :) )?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on December 06, 2004, 02:00:34 PM
Zero reason to save upgrade items.


Why? They're re-useable. If you find something better later and think "Geez, I wish I'd put that Vibration Cell in THAT", well.. you can. Just take it back out of whatever it's in and put it in the new item. Unlike D2 sockets, upgrades are completely reversible. :)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 06, 2004, 03:58:39 PM
Ah, awesome.  Like I said, n00b questions ;)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on December 06, 2004, 08:07:17 PM
Quote from: "Thrugg"
Ah, awesome.  Like I said, n00b questions ;)


That's okay. LegoAss has been playing this game for about a year longer than I have and he *still* asks me n00b questions. Like: "Which is better for my jedi - a lightsaber or a Vulkar Stun Baton?" or "Why won't Master Speed work with my armored scout build?"

:P
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 07, 2004, 12:53:36 AM
Or, uh, how do I beat Bendak with my level 5 soldier  :?
I can't seem to even scratch him with my dual vibroswords, and eventually I just run out of medpacs...
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on December 07, 2004, 01:04:35 AM
Grenades.

Lots and lots of them.

I usually start off with a Poison, followed by a Cygo (Freezing), and then run around and chuck whatever I can at him. The most important thing is to throw 'nades which keep him paralyzed.

Works like a charm.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 07, 2004, 08:16:56 AM
Quote from: "SirWarkof"
Grenades.

Lots and lots of them.

I usually start off with a Poison, followed by a Cygo (Freezing), and then run around and chuck whatever I can at him. The most important thing is to throw 'nades which keep him paralyzed.

Works like a charm.


What he said.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 07, 2004, 09:08:52 AM
Hmm, I tried that last night too without much luck :?   Well, I did some damage, but he killed me with his own grenades too fast.

The reason I'm asking is not so much because I hoped there might be some great secret to Bendak, but more because I'm not sure I'm doing combat the best possible way in general.  I've been more or less pseudo-turn-basing it, like BG.  Target bad guy with attack, hit space, let it run until end-of-round auto-pause, repeat.  

Should I be able to do it that way?  Please don't tell me I have to run around in real time, steering, moving, targeting, choosing special attacks, zig-zagging and healing all with the mouse and hotkeys and my extremely poor hand-eye co-ordination?  :oops:  I'm like the world's worst Quake player  :lol:
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 07, 2004, 11:32:01 AM
Personnally I prefer to keep control of my char during fights, ie use the move keys so that you can efficiently dodge the grenades he sends  at you.

I managed to defeat Bendak with a lvl 5 SCOUT, so this sure is doable, but yup, it requires a few try.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on December 07, 2004, 07:02:32 PM
You definately want to keep control of your character during fights. The computer will sometimes miss attacks because it wont' move properly on it's own.

I can usually (not always) beat Bendak with and L2 of and type. Make sure you have A: various kinds of stimpacks and other steroidy shots and B: LOTS of medpacks.

When the game pauses, just before the fight, take all of your stimpacks - adrenal, battle, strength, etc...

Charge him and start whacking. Remember that once a round, every round, you can use a medpack for free. Every two seconds or so (or right after he hits you - whichever rhythm works better), pause the game, click on the items menu, use a medpack, click out of the menu, and then resume the game. This way, you can use a medpack every round without sacrificing that rounds attack to do it. (You shouldn't be using Flurry or any other combat tactic at this point, so you'll only have 1 action/round).

Repeat until dead (either one of you  :P )
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 08, 2004, 09:39:50 AM
I read about that medpac trick (also can do it with energy shields I believe) but figured it was a bug.  Prefer not to exploit bugs.  Do we think that is an intentional game mechanic?

However I did work out what I was doing wrong, or rather wasn't doing right, and thanks everyone for the tips.  It honestly never occurred to me to just unpause and move about while in a combat situation.

In the end I beat him by running immediately sideways, pausing, targeting a grenade, turning back 180 degrees (ie not towards him, but past him, unpausing, then running as soon as the grenade was thrown, stop at other side of room, pause again, repeat.

Never took a single point of damage, although I find people's estimates of number of grenades required somewhat optimistic :)  I think I tossed at least 10.  And essentilly no hand-eye co-ordination required  :lol:

Anyway, after that, Sith base and Davik's estate were easy, had to take two tries at the turret subgame, but I am now a Jedi and about to take on greater Dantooine.

Is it wrong that I can't wait to hurry up and finish with this goody two-shoes and start a Dark side char?

Quote from: "Lego"
(You shouldn't be using Flurry or any other combat tactic at this point, so you'll only have 1 action/round).


Shouldn't as in "it's not a good idea" or as in "shouldn't be able to"?
When fighting single opponents, I have been using Critical Strike, because I have it, and I figured it was worth doing if I could.  What's the downside?
When does it become a good idea then?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 08, 2004, 03:45:59 PM
Critical Strike CAn become the most powerful attack in the game... Under some conditions.

To sum up: Flurry = 1 extra attack per round.
Critical Strike = chance of doing quadruple damage.

I'll spare you the maths (actually I'm too lazy to post them once more, already did a few times :P), but for Critical Strike to be efficient, you'll want to max your attacks per round. How do you do? Dual-wield (two attacks) and Master Speed (+2 attacks per round, and some AC).

With 4 attacks, each one having a chance to do quadruple damage, you'll tear through everything.

Another detail : you WANT to use the massive Critical crystal, and you probably want to go with two sabers instead of the saberstaff, because they have a better critical range. As long as you don't have MASTER critical strike, go with the keen crystal too (the one which doubles critical range).
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on December 08, 2004, 06:21:52 PM
It's as in "You really shouldn't", not as in "You can't"

For a character level that low, using a first tier combat power is going to get you creamed against someone like Bendak or Marl. Why, well, for a scoundrel using the Crit. Strike at that level, your /to-hit is going to blow, and you'll have a minus 5 to your ac every time you try to use it. Now, remember, pound for pound the most important and valuable number in the game is ac - worth 3 times it's weight in damage numbers. So, you won't be hitting him often, but he'll be hitting you every time. Flurry adds horrible penalties as well for a low level character when it's at it's first tier power as well. And for power attack, just do like we do and pretend it's not there ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 08, 2004, 06:28:49 PM
Yeah, after I read your post I went back and scrolled down the feat description  :lol:   I hadn't noticed the -5 AC.  Not nice of them to hide it down there out of sight :P  No wonder Bendak was walloping the snot out of me when I went melee with him!  Whew.  Well, I managed to bumble my way through Taris eventually anyway ;)  Lesson learnt.

Thanks for at least partially den00bing me.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on December 08, 2004, 06:36:46 PM
And your adventure has just barely begun. Congrats on the fun you're about to have with this gem, my freind!
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 08, 2004, 06:44:45 PM
May the Force be with you Thrugg, for long is the path to knowledge.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 12, 2004, 10:14:49 AM
OK, back again - apparently I suck at swoop racing.
I breezed through the plot-required one on Taris no problem, but it took me 20 tries to even beat the tier 1 time on Tatooine.
I admit I am not generally good at the fast-twitch stuff, but something like this where it is the same every time, I usually find practice makes perfect.  However, I seem to have hit a limit, even if I don't make any mistakes (miss a pad or hit a rock) and hit the shift as soon as it says to, I am only recording high 23s times (tier 1 is 23.90, tier 2 is 23.45 or something).

I did a few runs at low speed so I could map out the track, and I don't think the line I am taking is too bad.  There a a couple of pads past halfway that I just can't hit at the speed I am going, but I figure that is OK.

I hate leaving quests behind, even if it doesn't really matter.

Help?  :(   I thought maybe I'm not controlling it the best way (using A and D with space bar to shift)?
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on December 12, 2004, 10:19:29 AM
In all honesty, I don't know.

The swoop tracks after Taris were always buggy and slow, and I haven't reached them after installing new video card drivers and WinXP.

But you're not alone. We can form a club.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 12, 2004, 10:47:03 AM
Sadly, there's no secret but practice, practce, practice.

You need to know the races almost by heart to get as many boost arrows as you can. I think there is a faq on gamefaqs about it, with basic "plans" of the circuits.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 19, 2004, 11:04:23 AM
OK, just wanted to say thanks all, I finished it for the first time last night, and by the end my char was having an easy time of it.  

This didn't matter in the end because the last battle was no problem, but I did have one last question out of curiosity - (tries to avoid spoilers) the things of which there are nine in the room for the last battle, I could target them, but I only had two force powers that I could select - and neither did anything.  Am I to assume there are other force powers that may have done something, that I just didn't have?  My second time through will be less Guardiany and more Consulary so it may be useful to know.

My final char was probably not a standard build, as I decided the force powers were so fun that I wandered away from the pure Soldier/Guardian build I started out aiming for.

Soldier 5 Guardian 15 Light Side Master
18 Str (inc +3 LSM bonus and +3 Sith Power Gloves)
23 Dex (inc +4 Adv Alac implant)
12 Con
8 Int
27 Wis (inc +5 Star Forge Robes, +5 Circlet of Serash)
14 Cha
260 Vit points, 250 Force points <- this really was the fun bit
27 Defence
17/19/19 saves

Skills were weak obviously (just Persuade and Treat), but had max Two Weapon and Critical for fighting, and max Implant and Toughness for buffing.  Force powers were Cure, Speed, Valour obviously, and also Push and Stun, all maxed.

Wielded dual sabers, before going to the final planet I went to Yavin and blew my savings on the two uber crystals, and had Mantle/Solari/Damind in one and Heart/Krayt/Upari in the other.  Which kicks some dark side butt.

The hard part by the end was choosing whether to hit everything for 2 lots of 50 points each round or to knock them over with my irresistable Force Wave.  Heh heh.

Already started a DS Scoundrel/Consular beeatch, and finding it much harder early on (not surprisingly).  I suck at playing sorcs.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on December 19, 2004, 12:04:37 PM
I had the most HORRIBLE experiences my first couple of times trying the scoundrel/consular (sorc) route. I mostly got slapped around and pwned till I restarted as a Scout. But last time I tried it, for some reason, I kicked buutocs. Went with 1 saber, Crit Strike, split it 7/13.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: SirWarkof on December 19, 2004, 12:17:59 PM
Quote from: "Legolas"
I had the most HORRIBLE experiences my first couple of times trying the scoundrel/consular (sorc) route. I mostly got slapped around and pwned till I restarted as a Scout. But last time I tried it, for some reason, I kicked buutocs. Went with 1 saber, Crit Strike, split it 7/13.


Once you start that dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. Take heed of the Mictar side.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on December 19, 2004, 12:37:38 PM
That's literally how it's pronounced in these here parts, like "Boo-tocks"
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 20, 2004, 01:19:32 PM
Good job Thrugg!

Yup, Force Wave is waayy too powerful. Stun, Area of Effect, damage in one Force Power.

Oh, and as no one answered your question, yes, some powers can be effective on the "chambers" as you called them. Life Drain (and its upgraded version, Death Field) is an example, I don't remember the other ones.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Pixelated on December 20, 2004, 01:56:57 PM
Quote from: "Mad Godji"
Oh, and as no one answered your question, yes, some powers can be effective on the "chambers" as you called them. Life Drain (and its upgraded version, Death Field) is an example, I don't remember the other ones.


Destroy droid.

(Perhaps the most useful lightside power)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Lego on December 20, 2004, 02:29:53 PM
1: Agreed. Destroy Droid is the single Force Power that ALL builds of ANY type MUST have. All others are, to a certain extent, debatable (and sometimes redundant), but NOT this one ;-)

2: Throw lightsaber also works very well in that "situation" Thrugg ;-)
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 20, 2004, 02:35:29 PM
I usually let Jolee be the "Destroy Droid" user in my party seeing he always has the two first levels of that power.

But I 101.92% agree on its usefulness.
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Jedi44 on December 20, 2004, 04:35:39 PM
Hmm, the Destroy Droid is very useful in KOTOR 1. KOTOR 2? No thanks...
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Thrugg on December 21, 2004, 08:30:14 AM
A game-maker making a list of the most over-powered skills in the first game and then nerfing them all in the new version?!  Inconceivable!
Title: Beginning Stats for Scoundrel/Guardian
Post by: Mad Godji on December 21, 2004, 09:52:39 AM
Quote from: "Thrugg"
A game-maker making a list of the most over-powered skills in the first game and then nerfing them all in the new version?!  Inconceivable!


Not the sort of things which would happen with Diablo! ;) :P